04-23-2025, 02:02 PMCementHands Wrote: Yea, like sometimes you accidentally find an exploit in the sim engine, forget to report it because your phone died, then regress all of your players to fit the exploit, and then run through the rest of the league like a warm knife through butter.
It was a really fun moment for the rest of the league.
Piggybacking on this because you took it way too far.
I’ve been thinking a lot about how Hamilton is being talked about around here, and honestly, I think it’s getting out of hand. There’s this constant narrative that Hamilton is all about stirring up hate and drama, and it just doesn’t sit right with me. The thing is, people do change—and that’s something we should recognize, right?
Sure, Hamilton’s had its share of messy moments. No group is perfect, and I’m sure not everyone’s been happy with everything they’ve done. But here’s the thing: people grow. If we really believe that people can change, why do we keep holding onto this image of them from the past? It feels like some people are stuck on the idea of Hamilton as these "bad guys," when in reality, they’ve evolved a lot. But when some members keep responding with harsh accusations and hostility, it just makes the divide worse. Instead of making things better, we’re all just pushing each other further apart.
It’s also important to acknowledge that when people feel attacked or unfairly treated, they sometimes react impulsively. We’ve all been there. In heated moments, it’s easy to get defensive, say things we don’t mean, or take an approach that only adds to the conflict. It’s not always the best way to handle things, but it comes from frustration—a feeling that people aren’t being heard or understood. That’s not an excuse, but it’s a reality in most online spaces. Instead of judging past actions, maybe it’s better to look at why those reactions happened and whether they’ve learned to handle things differently.
What’s frustrating, though, is that this cycle of defensiveness and frustration has contributed to a shift in how we talk here. The atmosphere used to be more laid-back, casual, and honest. We could disagree and hash things out without feeling like everything had to be carefully worded or sanitized. Sure, it wasn’t perfect—there were definitely moments of missteps, awkward exchanges, and conflicts that could have been handled better. But at least it felt real. We didn’t have to tiptoe around every conversation, and even when things got heated, they got resolved in a way that felt more human. Now, it feels like there's this constant pressure to toe the line, to present ourselves in this overly “positive” light, and any real, unfiltered opinion gets shut down fast. The forum has lost some of that raw, unpolished energy that made it feel like a real place to connect. It’s like we’re all trying to put on a show of being "perfectly inclusive" rather than just having real conversations, flaws and all. Maybe this is due to spaces such as the Thunderdome being removed, maybe it isn't.
This shift isn’t just a matter of people being cautious about stepping on toes. It’s also created this "astroturfing" effect, where it feels like the forum's vibe has been carefully curated and manufactured. Everyone’s on their best behavior, and there’s this overarching sense that if you’re not part of the “approved” way of thinking, you’ll be called out. It’s made things feel artificial, like we’re more focused on maintaining an image than engaging in genuine discussion.
I get it—cliques happen. It’s natural for people to group up with folks they vibe with. But with Hamilton, it feels like it’s gone beyond the usual “group dynamics.” The rumors and harsh labels floating around just create this one-sided, unfair reputation. And honestly, it’s starting to feel ridiculous.
What gets under my skin the most is how everything feels so overly “positive” now, like the forum’s pushing this idealistic version of “we’re all so inclusive and perfect.” It’s great to be supportive, but it starts to feel kinda fake after a while. The conversations have become so polished that it’s hard to even have a real discussion. It’s like everything has to be framed in this super-positive light, and any kind of disagreement or criticism gets shut down quickly.
And the thing is, the same drama that we’re trying to keep off the forum is still happening in Discord chats. You don’t have to look far to see toxicity and harassment behind the scenes, but since it’s not out in the open, it’s easy to pretend it’s not a problem. Just because certain things aren’t getting called out on the forum doesn’t mean they’ve disappeared.
Honestly, I think what we need more of here is a bit of fairness and a willingness to look at things from different perspectives. If we really want people to improve and grow, we can’t keep holding their past against them. Hamilton—just like everyone else—deserves a chance to show they’ve changed. Instead of spreading rumors and dividing the community further, maybe we should focus on having open conversations and giving people the chance to prove who they are now, not just who they were.
04-23-2025, 08:53 PMFerda Wrote: This shift isn’t just a matter of people being cautious about stepping on toes. It’s also created this "astroturfing" effect, where it feels like the forum's vibe has been carefully curated and manufactured. Everyone’s on their best behavior, and there’s this overarching sense that if you’re not part of the “approved” way of thinking, you’ll be called out. It’s made things feel artificial, like we’re more focused on maintaining an image than engaging in genuine discussion.
04-23-2025, 09:10 PM5ympathies Wrote: agree with this big time
Can you give me an example of this? Is it like, because we don’t allow hate speech, or what, what is it that’s so manicured and polished?
I’m gonna be honest I think a lot of this just has to do with our main community “shooting the shit” spaces having shifted to discord. I’m not on the forum sharing all my dirty jokes and memes and stuff all the time, I’m doing that in my locker rooms. I’m on my best behavior on here most of the time because this is where we keep all the records and stuff and it feels more “official” and I think that might be the case for a lot of people.
I don’t think people disagree any less than they used to - I’m happy to disagree with people, and I’ve done some of that on here today, but more often than not if I need to talk something out with somebody, I just message them on discord and try to clear the air, I don’t spray the whole messy conversation across the site for it to get dragged out into 100 pages of chaos. I don’t think we’ve really lost our messiness, we’ve just relocated it.
04-23-2025, 09:25 PMsköldpaddor Wrote: Can you give me an example of this? Is it like, because we don’t allow hate speech, or what, what is it that’s so manicured and polished?
I’m gonna be honest I think a lot of this just has to do with our main community “shooting the shit” spaces having shifted to discord. I’m not on the forum sharing all my dirty jokes and memes and stuff all the time, I’m doing that in my locker rooms. I’m on my best behavior on here most of the time because this is where we keep all the records and stuff and it feels more “official” and I think that might be the case for a lot of people.
I don’t think people disagree any less than they used to - I’m happy to disagree with people, and I’ve done some of that on here today, but more often than not if I need to talk something out with somebody, I just message them on discord and try to clear the air, I don’t spray the whole messy conversation across the site for it to get dragged out into 100 pages of chaos. I don’t think we’ve really lost our messiness, we’ve just relocated it.
bringing up hate speech as a potential reason unprovoked is crazy imo, but regarding the rest of it, I agree with your last line. The relocation of the messiness has made everything feel very segregated, and everything is contained to each LR.
04-23-2025, 08:53 PMFerda Wrote: Piggybacking on this because you took it way too far.
I’ve been thinking a lot about how Hamilton is being talked about around here, and honestly, I think it’s getting out of hand. There’s this constant narrative that Hamilton is all about stirring up hate and drama, and it just doesn’t sit right with me. The thing is, people do change—and that’s something we should recognize, right?
Sure, Hamilton’s had its share of messy moments. No group is perfect, and I’m sure not everyone’s been happy with everything they’ve done. But here’s the thing: people grow. If we really believe that people can change, why do we keep holding onto this image of them from the past? It feels like some people are stuck on the idea of Hamilton as these "bad guys," when in reality, they’ve evolved a lot. But when some members keep responding with harsh accusations and hostility, it just makes the divide worse. Instead of making things better, we’re all just pushing each other further apart.
It’s also important to acknowledge that when people feel attacked or unfairly treated, they sometimes react impulsively. We’ve all been there. In heated moments, it’s easy to get defensive, say things we don’t mean, or take an approach that only adds to the conflict. It’s not always the best way to handle things, but it comes from frustration—a feeling that people aren’t being heard or understood. That’s not an excuse, but it’s a reality in most online spaces. Instead of judging past actions, maybe it’s better to look at why those reactions happened and whether they’ve learned to handle things differently.
What’s frustrating, though, is that this cycle of defensiveness and frustration has contributed to a shift in how we talk here. The atmosphere used to be more laid-back, casual, and honest. We could disagree and hash things out without feeling like everything had to be carefully worded or sanitized. Sure, it wasn’t perfect—there were definitely moments of missteps, awkward exchanges, and conflicts that could have been handled better. But at least it felt real. We didn’t have to tiptoe around every conversation, and even when things got heated, they got resolved in a way that felt more human. Now, it feels like there's this constant pressure to toe the line, to present ourselves in this overly “positive” light, and any real, unfiltered opinion gets shut down fast. The forum has lost some of that raw, unpolished energy that made it feel like a real place to connect. It’s like we’re all trying to put on a show of being "perfectly inclusive" rather than just having real conversations, flaws and all. Maybe this is due to spaces such as the Thunderdome being removed, maybe it isn't.
This shift isn’t just a matter of people being cautious about stepping on toes. It’s also created this "astroturfing" effect, where it feels like the forum's vibe has been carefully curated and manufactured. Everyone’s on their best behavior, and there’s this overarching sense that if you’re not part of the “approved” way of thinking, you’ll be called out. It’s made things feel artificial, like we’re more focused on maintaining an image than engaging in genuine discussion.
I get it—cliques happen. It’s natural for people to group up with folks they vibe with. But with Hamilton, it feels like it’s gone beyond the usual “group dynamics.” The rumors and harsh labels floating around just create this one-sided, unfair reputation. And honestly, it’s starting to feel ridiculous.
What gets under my skin the most is how everything feels so overly “positive” now, like the forum’s pushing this idealistic version of “we’re all so inclusive and perfect.” It’s great to be supportive, but it starts to feel kinda fake after a while. The conversations have become so polished that it’s hard to even have a real discussion. It’s like everything has to be framed in this super-positive light, and any kind of disagreement or criticism gets shut down quickly.
And the thing is, the same drama that we’re trying to keep off the forum is still happening in Discord chats. You don’t have to look far to see toxicity and harassment behind the scenes, but since it’s not out in the open, it’s easy to pretend it’s not a problem. Just because certain things aren’t getting called out on the forum doesn’t mean they’ve disappeared.
Honestly, I think what we need more of here is a bit of fairness and a willingness to look at things from different perspectives. If we really want people to improve and grow, we can’t keep holding their past against them. Hamilton—just like everyone else—deserves a chance to show they’ve changed. Instead of spreading rumors and dividing the community further, maybe we should focus on having open conversations and giving people the chance to prove who they are now, not just who they were.
04-23-2025, 09:40 PM5ympathies Wrote: bringing up hate speech as a potential reason unprovoked is crazy imo, but regarding the rest of it, I agree with your last line. The relocation of the messiness has made everything feel very segregated, and everything is contained to each LR.
Honestly valid, I’m just used to the “you can’t even JOKE anymore, things are too WOKE” argument that gets thrown around when what people really mean is “I get bad responses when I say offensive things now!” so that was a little projection
04-23-2025, 09:50 PM(This post was last modified: 04-23-2025, 09:51 PM by sytarah. Edited 3 times in total.)
04-23-2025, 09:25 PMsköldpaddor Wrote: Can you give me an example of this? Is it like, because we don’t allow hate speech, or what, what is it that’s so manicured and polished?
I’m gonna be honest I think a lot of this just has to do with our main community “shooting the shit” spaces having shifted to discord. I’m not on the forum sharing all my dirty jokes and memes and stuff all the time, I’m doing that in my locker rooms. I’m on my best behavior on here most of the time because this is where we keep all the records and stuff and it feels more “official” and I think that might be the case for a lot of people.
I don’t think people disagree any less than they used to - I’m happy to disagree with people, and I’ve done some of that on here today, but more often than not if I need to talk something out with somebody, I just message them on discord and try to clear the air, I don’t spray the whole messy conversation across the site for it to get dragged out into 100 pages of chaos. I don’t think we’ve really lost our messiness, we’ve just relocated it.
04-23-2025, 08:53 PMFerda Wrote: Piggybacking on this because you took it way too far.
I’ve been thinking a lot about how Hamilton is being talked about around here, and honestly, I think it’s getting out of hand. There’s this constant narrative that Hamilton is all about stirring up hate and drama, and it just doesn’t sit right with me. The thing is, people do change—and that’s something we should recognize, right?
Sure, Hamilton’s had its share of messy moments. No group is perfect, and I’m sure not everyone’s been happy with everything they’ve done. But here’s the thing: people grow. If we really believe that people can change, why do we keep holding onto this image of them from the past? It feels like some people are stuck on the idea of Hamilton as these "bad guys," when in reality, they’ve evolved a lot. But when some members keep responding with harsh accusations and hostility, it just makes the divide worse. Instead of making things better, we’re all just pushing each other further apart.
It’s also important to acknowledge that when people feel attacked or unfairly treated, they sometimes react impulsively. We’ve all been there. In heated moments, it’s easy to get defensive, say things we don’t mean, or take an approach that only adds to the conflict. It’s not always the best way to handle things, but it comes from frustration—a feeling that people aren’t being heard or understood. That’s not an excuse, but it’s a reality in most online spaces. Instead of judging past actions, maybe it’s better to look at why those reactions happened and whether they’ve learned to handle things differently.
What’s frustrating, though, is that this cycle of defensiveness and frustration has contributed to a shift in how we talk here. The atmosphere used to be more laid-back, casual, and honest. We could disagree and hash things out without feeling like everything had to be carefully worded or sanitized. Sure, it wasn’t perfect—there were definitely moments of missteps, awkward exchanges, and conflicts that could have been handled better. But at least it felt real. We didn’t have to tiptoe around every conversation, and even when things got heated, they got resolved in a way that felt more human. Now, it feels like there's this constant pressure to toe the line, to present ourselves in this overly “positive” light, and any real, unfiltered opinion gets shut down fast. The forum has lost some of that raw, unpolished energy that made it feel like a real place to connect. It’s like we’re all trying to put on a show of being "perfectly inclusive" rather than just having real conversations, flaws and all. Maybe this is due to spaces such as the Thunderdome being removed, maybe it isn't.
This shift isn’t just a matter of people being cautious about stepping on toes. It’s also created this "astroturfing" effect, where it feels like the forum's vibe has been carefully curated and manufactured. Everyone’s on their best behavior, and there’s this overarching sense that if you’re not part of the “approved” way of thinking, you’ll be called out. It’s made things feel artificial, like we’re more focused on maintaining an image than engaging in genuine discussion.
I get it—cliques happen. It’s natural for people to group up with folks they vibe with. But with Hamilton, it feels like it’s gone beyond the usual “group dynamics.” The rumors and harsh labels floating around just create this one-sided, unfair reputation. And honestly, it’s starting to feel ridiculous.
What gets under my skin the most is how everything feels so overly “positive” now, like the forum’s pushing this idealistic version of “we’re all so inclusive and perfect.” It’s great to be supportive, but it starts to feel kinda fake after a while. The conversations have become so polished that it’s hard to even have a real discussion. It’s like everything has to be framed in this super-positive light, and any kind of disagreement or criticism gets shut down quickly.
And the thing is, the same drama that we’re trying to keep off the forum is still happening in Discord chats. You don’t have to look far to see toxicity and harassment behind the scenes, but since it’s not out in the open, it’s easy to pretend it’s not a problem. Just because certain things aren’t getting called out on the forum doesn’t mean they’ve disappeared.
Honestly, I think what we need more of here is a bit of fairness and a willingness to look at things from different perspectives. If we really want people to improve and grow, we can’t keep holding their past against them. Hamilton—just like everyone else—deserves a chance to show they’ve changed. Instead of spreading rumors and dividing the community further, maybe we should focus on having open conversations and giving people the chance to prove who they are now, not just who they were.
Hamilton got punished like 2 days ago for things that happened in their discord. I also think if you check this thread the people who are trolling and keeping this off track from any productive discussion generally have ties to one team. Maybe it's unfair and I do think Heta and Aleks are good people and there's some great people in that locker room, but there's definitely some people going out of their way to hurt the collective in that section.
“The Wheel of Time turns, and Ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again. ... There are neither beginnings nor endings to the Wheel of Time. But it was a beginning.”
04-23-2025, 09:25 PMsköldpaddor Wrote: Can you give me an example of this? Is it like, because we don’t allow hate speech, or what, what is it that’s so manicured and polished?
I’m gonna be honest I think a lot of this just has to do with our main community “shooting the shit” spaces having shifted to discord. I’m not on the forum sharing all my dirty jokes and memes and stuff all the time, I’m doing that in my locker rooms. I’m on my best behavior on here most of the time because this is where we keep all the records and stuff and it feels more “official” and I think that might be the case for a lot of people.
I don’t think people disagree any less than they used to - I’m happy to disagree with people, and I’ve done some of that on here today, but more often than not if I need to talk something out with somebody, I just message them on discord and try to clear the air, I don’t spray the whole messy conversation across the site for it to get dragged out into 100 pages of chaos. I don’t think we’ve really lost our messiness, we’ve just relocated it.
Hey, I feel like we might be missing each other here a bit. I get what you're saying about the shift in spaces and how things have gotten more 'official'—I totally see that. But the main thing I was trying to get across about Hamilton is that there's a lot of focus on their past mistakes, and it's almost like we’re not acknowledging the growth they've shown. I’m not saying people should just forget everything, but if we really want to support growth, it feels like we should stop fixating on past actions and allow for change. The community vibe feels a bit off to me because it seems like there’s a lot of judgment based on what people used to do, rather than who they are now.
You mentioned the no-hate-speech rule, and I absolutely agree that it's important to keep things respectful. But for me, it feels like there’s a difference between keeping hate speech in check and creating an atmosphere where everything feels so polished that it’s hard to have a real, honest conversation. It’s like we’ve moved away from being able to laugh things off or disagree in a way that feels human. In the past, there was room for awkwardness, for disagreement, for messiness—even if it wasn't always perfect, we could joke around and move on. Now, it feels like if anything gets said that doesn’t fit into this super ‘positive’ or ‘safe’ box, it gets shut down or critiqued instantly. It’s tough to even laugh things off anymore without worrying that it’ll be taken the wrong way or criticized.
And about Discord—yeah, I totally get that it’s more of a space for unfiltered conversation. But even there, it feels like some of the same toxicity gets hidden behind closed doors, and it’s almost like we’re pretending it doesn’t affect the broader community. I’m not trying to argue with you, but I think my point got a bit lost in the mix—it’s less about just the ‘messiness’ of disagreements and more about how we treat people who are trying to change, and how we’ve lost the ability to just laugh things off, or let things slide.
04-23-2025, 09:50 PMHabsFanFromOntario Wrote: Hamilton got punished like 2 days ago for things that happened in their discord. I also think if you check this thread the people who are trolling and keeping this off track from any productive discussion generally have ties to one team. Maybe it's unfair and I do think Heta and Aleks are good people and there's some great people in that locker room, but there's definitely some people going out of their way to hurt the collective in that section.
I see what you’re saying, and you're right that there are individuals who are definitely still causing issues. I’m not excusing anyone’s actions, and I do think people should be held accountable for their behavior, whether it's on Discord or elsewhere. But the problem I have is that it feels like Hamilton as a whole is getting dragged into this every time something happens with certain individuals. Sure, some people in Hamilton are still acting out of line, but that doesn't mean the entire group should be painted with the same brush. And it’s frustrating when users like @sytarah, who are constantly being immature and adding fuel to the Hamilton hate, only make things worse for everyone involved.
You mentioned that Hamilton just got punished recently for things happening in Discord, and I totally get that those actions need to be addressed. But the issue is, when we keep bundling them all together, it feels like the good people in the group are unfairly being held to the same standard as those who are still causing problems. Heta, Aleks, and others in that section may be doing their best to keep things positive, but it’s hard to separate their efforts from the actions of the others when the entire team gets dragged through the mud every time someone messes up.
I think it’s important to recognize the growth that’s happening on the individual level while still holding people accountable for their actions. It’s just frustrating that the narrative often turns into one big pile-on where everyone gets labeled the same, even when some are genuinely trying to move forward and improve.
04-23-2025, 09:50 PMHabsFanFromOntario Wrote: Hamilton got punished like 2 days ago for things that happened in their discord. I also think if you check this thread the people who are trolling and keeping this off track from any productive discussion generally have ties to one team. Maybe it's unfair and I do think Heta and Aleks are good people and there's some great people in that locker room, but there's definitely some people going out of their way to hurt the collective in that section.
don't you think it would be a good idea to judge users in isolation instead of going after the entire team?
04-23-2025, 09:59 PMFerda Wrote: I see what you’re saying, and you're right that there are individuals who are definitely still causing issues. I’m not excusing anyone’s actions, and I do think people should be held accountable for their behavior, whether it's on Discord or elsewhere. But the problem I have is that it feels like Hamilton as a whole is getting dragged into this every time something happens with certain individuals. Sure, some people in Hamilton are still acting out of line, but that doesn't mean the entire group should be painted with the same brush. And it’s frustrating when users like @sytarah, who are constantly being immature and adding fuel to the Hamilton hate, only make things worse for everyone involved.
You mentioned that Hamilton just got punished recently for things happening in Discord, and I totally get that those actions need to be addressed. But the issue is, when we keep bundling them all together, it feels like the good people in the group are unfairly being held to the same standard as those who are still causing problems. Heta, Aleks, and others in that section may be doing their best to keep things positive, but it’s hard to separate their efforts from the actions of the others when the entire team gets dragged through the mud every time someone messes up.
I think it’s important to recognize the growth that’s happening on the individual level while still holding people accountable for their actions. It’s just frustrating that the narrative often turns into one big pile-on where everyone gets labeled the same, even when some are genuinely trying to move forward and improve.
A team is a collection of individuals, if 2/3/4 people from that team are constantly being like that it gives the impressions it's accepted and encouraged some becomes a reflection of them. I think the league has definitely always been clique-y to a degree, hell we had the crew back in the day for my old heads, and I encourage people to reach out to others not on their team and talk to them. There's lots of cool people in the league I've met in the past year or so by just going out of my way to interact with people I might not have had a chance to. That said, I don't think it's unfair to hold Hamilton accountable for the actions of people in their realm especially when this has gone on for a long time.
“The Wheel of Time turns, and Ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again. ... There are neither beginnings nor endings to the Wheel of Time. But it was a beginning.”
04-23-2025, 10:04 PMHabsFanFromOntario Wrote: A team is a collection of individuals, if 2/3/4 people from that team are constantly being like that it gives the impressions it's accepted and encouraged some becomes a reflection of them. I think the league has definitely always been clique-y to a degree, hell we had the crew back in the day for my old heads, and I encourage people to reach out to others not on their team and talk to them. There's lots of cool people in the league I've met in the past year or so by just going out of my way to interact with people I might not have had a chance to. That said, I don't think it's unfair to hold Hamilton accountable for the actions of people in their realm especially when this has gone on for a long time.
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